loud clicks....and a long post, sorry
Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2003 7:49 amokay. this might go with the loud sound burst thread. but i really don't know. this is something slightly different from what i have read.
I have this choon that i am working on. and of course i am working with sounds that i have created from test tones, and also a drum track that is actualy made up of about five different breaks. so in this drum track i have two kicks being hit at once. one is lowpassed so that any cymbals or high end transiants are gone. i used that to give the original kick more presence. that is really the only important aspect of the break that is needed to be understood.
now for my bass patch. i have four voices there, i will have to look again, but i believe those, or some are being lowpassed to give it the particular sound i wanted. i could be wrong.. i can't really remember right off hand. and my lead is just the same sound pitched up of course.
in the middle section of my song, i go into the drums, the bass, and the duplicated bass lead all together. about every measure there is a loud click that hits when the lead, the bass and the kick are all triggered. this phenominam was present with the lead and bass alone, but not quite so hard hitting, and very rare. and it only clicked when both the lead and bass hit the same time. just like with the kick. if the notes are being held and the drum plays on, there is no clicking when the kick hits. another thing is, when i do a lpf sweep on the drums, the kicks produce loud clicks as they sweep down while being played over the top of the bass and the lead notes that are being held.
so i think the problem lies with the lowpass filter, but perhaps not completely. i believe this is an artifact of some sort.
what i have in common with all these sounds are as follows. they all had to have their attacks trimmed so i could hit a zero crossing for the waves, and the kicks were in the middle of a break so i of course had to cut those in a way that the kick's attack would sound and not the "dead" space before it.
what i am thinking is this: the lowpass filter amplifies the missed zero crossings in certian circumstances. and because of all these voices are being played at once. a total of ten, and with lowpasses in sync, there is an extremely loud click. i do not believe this is a side effect of a massive amount of polyphony because i have made complicated waves that have several voices and there was never a click. but then they didn't have lowpass filters closed on any of it.
another reason why i believe it is the lowpass filter: when i chop a break, like the amen, i would take the pieces and reconstruct them at the tempo my sampler said they were at from the beat mugger. then what i would do is lowpass them. i discovered that if i cut the break somewhat sloppy, i would get clicks as each sample went by. i mean loud clicks. as if i missed a zero crossing. but when the samples are played together with an open filter. it sounded as fluent as the orginal break. not much issue hear since the breaks are sped up and thus are not aloud to play through their entirety.
and in realality, this issue is not much of one since i record 1 track at a time, and there is no loud clicking going on. i feel that the issue lays in a slightly closed lowpass filter (anything other than a frequency of 200000), like the kick. i am almost certian if i resampled that kick, i would not have the clicking issue at all.
i will play around with this, and see what kind of things i can find out. and maybe you guys would have some ideas too. and if you suffer from those loud sound burst... maybe you can find something in common, like perhaps multiple uses of filters on several tracks at once.
mmmmm.. sorry for the long post.
just wanted to throw this out at you guys. oh and i am using 4.1 by the way.....
I have this choon that i am working on. and of course i am working with sounds that i have created from test tones, and also a drum track that is actualy made up of about five different breaks. so in this drum track i have two kicks being hit at once. one is lowpassed so that any cymbals or high end transiants are gone. i used that to give the original kick more presence. that is really the only important aspect of the break that is needed to be understood.
now for my bass patch. i have four voices there, i will have to look again, but i believe those, or some are being lowpassed to give it the particular sound i wanted. i could be wrong.. i can't really remember right off hand. and my lead is just the same sound pitched up of course.
in the middle section of my song, i go into the drums, the bass, and the duplicated bass lead all together. about every measure there is a loud click that hits when the lead, the bass and the kick are all triggered. this phenominam was present with the lead and bass alone, but not quite so hard hitting, and very rare. and it only clicked when both the lead and bass hit the same time. just like with the kick. if the notes are being held and the drum plays on, there is no clicking when the kick hits. another thing is, when i do a lpf sweep on the drums, the kicks produce loud clicks as they sweep down while being played over the top of the bass and the lead notes that are being held.
so i think the problem lies with the lowpass filter, but perhaps not completely. i believe this is an artifact of some sort.
what i have in common with all these sounds are as follows. they all had to have their attacks trimmed so i could hit a zero crossing for the waves, and the kicks were in the middle of a break so i of course had to cut those in a way that the kick's attack would sound and not the "dead" space before it.
what i am thinking is this: the lowpass filter amplifies the missed zero crossings in certian circumstances. and because of all these voices are being played at once. a total of ten, and with lowpasses in sync, there is an extremely loud click. i do not believe this is a side effect of a massive amount of polyphony because i have made complicated waves that have several voices and there was never a click. but then they didn't have lowpass filters closed on any of it.
another reason why i believe it is the lowpass filter: when i chop a break, like the amen, i would take the pieces and reconstruct them at the tempo my sampler said they were at from the beat mugger. then what i would do is lowpass them. i discovered that if i cut the break somewhat sloppy, i would get clicks as each sample went by. i mean loud clicks. as if i missed a zero crossing. but when the samples are played together with an open filter. it sounded as fluent as the orginal break. not much issue hear since the breaks are sped up and thus are not aloud to play through their entirety.
and in realality, this issue is not much of one since i record 1 track at a time, and there is no loud clicking going on. i feel that the issue lays in a slightly closed lowpass filter (anything other than a frequency of 200000), like the kick. i am almost certian if i resampled that kick, i would not have the clicking issue at all.
i will play around with this, and see what kind of things i can find out. and maybe you guys would have some ideas too. and if you suffer from those loud sound burst... maybe you can find something in common, like perhaps multiple uses of filters on several tracks at once.
mmmmm.. sorry for the long post.
just wanted to throw this out at you guys. oh and i am using 4.1 by the way.....